Episode 3: Wolves, biodiversity, and food security with Susan Bragdon
In this episode of Raincoast Radio’s Of Wolves and Women, international lawyer and natural resource ecologist Susan Bragdon discusses her early work as a young girl studying wolves in captivity. She shares the groundbreaking discovery her observations led to about the role of female wolves, challenging the biases that had shaped previous understandings. We also explore the dynamic nature of wolf interactions and the importance of considering personality in understanding wolves and advancing wildlife conservation.
“I saw different aspects of [Sitka’s] personality and it made me realize, oh, I had been making a lot of assumptions about who these animals are and how they interact with one another. It taught me the lesson that change is part of life, and to be open and curious, and to be paying attention, and to expect that there will be change.”
Susan Bragdon
From wolves to multilateral negotiations, Susan shares how her desire to protect wildlife and biological diversity led her to recognize the importance of agricultural diversity for food and nutrition security. Driven by a passion for both science and advocacy, she discusses her career as an international lawyer working with the United Nations and the founding of Seeds for All — a non-profit dedicated to supporting and expanding agroecology by amplifying the voices and participation of small-scale farmers and promoting inclusive, democratic governance.
“I always think of Darwin […] He said, ‘If we have this evolutionary continuity, we have to recognize the possibility that animals have experiences that are similar to human beings.’ That’s a continuity. That’s what I mean when I say common humanity with wildlife—that we have a lot in common. And to look for that amongst us as human beings and amongst us in terms of all life. The importance of this has been reinforced while working with wolves to working in multilateral negotiations.”
Susan Bragdon
Susan H. Bragdon is an international lawyer, natural resource ecologist and U.S. patent agent with more than 25 years of experience working with governments, United Nations agencies and multilateral institutions and donor organizations on policy and science related to sustainable food systems, biological diversity, small-scale farmers, and agroecology.
She served as Legal Advisor to the Convention on Biological Diversity and was the first attorney-senior scientist hired within the Consultative Group on International Agricultural Research (CGIAR) at a senior level to develop and implement policy strategy on plant genetic diversity and food security and to leverage its role through critical partnerships. Susan also developed and led the Food and Sustainability Programme at the Quaker United Nations Office in Geneva and was a Policy Advisor for Oxfam Novib’s Sowing Diversity=Harvesting Security Programme.
Susan is the Director of Seeds for All, a non-profit organization with a mission to support and expand agroecology by amplifying the voices and participation of small-scale farmers and building democratic, participatory and inclusive governance at all levels.
Additional resources
- Seeds for All
- Susan H. Bragdon’s early wolf research
- Books mentioned throughout the episode
- The Wolf: The Ecology and Behavior of an Endangered Species by L. David Mech
- Films featuring Gudrun Pflüger
- Learn more about our Wolf Conservation Program
Topics discussed
[00:45] – Susan’s introduction
[01:34] – Studying wolves as a thirteen year old
[05:30] – Working with Paul Paquet as a research assistant at the Oregon Zoo
[08:00] – Value of being curious, passionate and open
[08:40] – Experiencing joy in the research and being part of the research team
[10:37] – Observing a captive wolf pack
[12:40] – Jane Goodall as an inspiration and conservation leader
[13:30] – Individuals and their personalities matter
[15:17] – Animal personality, learned behaviours, and conservation
[18:00] – A revolutionary discovery about female wolves
[20:08] – Exposing the bias
[22:47] – Challenges and obstacles faced as a young woman
[24:40] – Working with wolf researcher Jenny Ryon
[25:15] – Raising wolf pups
[26:50] – Presenting at the first international wolf symposium in 1978
[29:55] – Stories and lessons learned from individual wolves
[30:42] – The dynamic nature of wolf interactions
[33:35] – Rick McIntyre’s work and the personalities of wolf leaders
[35:50] – Wolves as an entry point into Susan’s career
[37:10] – Using science and law for the conservation of biological diversity
[37:55] – Working with the United Nations
[42:35] – Food and nutrition security
[42:50] – Agroecology and agrobiodiversity
[45:32] – The link between wildlife conservation and food security
[46:50] – Being open to the interconnections
[47:55] – Learning from Traditional Knowledge
[49:45] – Elevating voices and finding common ground
[51:07] – Seeds For All
[53:10] – Integrating different knowledge systems into policy
[56:10] – The importance of innovative and adaptive practices
[59:50] – What has working with wildlife and human beings taught you about yourself?
[1:01:30] – Advice for young women and girls
About Raincoast Radio
Raincoast Radio is created by Raincoast Conservation Foundation. It is produced by Sofia Osborne with additional audio editing by Oumar Salifou. Fact checking by the Raincoast team. The wolf photo in the podcast art is by Mark Williams. Music by Crypt-of-Insomnia and Luca Francini.
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